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Help needed with low volume from A1.4 - Underpowered Receiver ?

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  • Help needed with low volume from A1.4 - Underpowered Receiver ?

    Recently bought a pair of Chane A1.4, upgraded from Energy Classic 5.1 - for a small 13 X 15 living room, for mainly watching TV, movies and music. It is powered by yamaha RX-V471 - as the spec says 85 W/Ch - 2 Ch driven. YPAO configured for 5.1, but listening in straight(2.1) mode set on the receiver mostly.

    TV and movies through roku and apple tv, music through htpc optically connected.

    Speakers are broken-in now its been a month, positioned at ear level and 30 degree angle for LR from seating position. Nothing else has changed except for the L and R and upgrading the others are budgeted for end of this year.

    The speakers are amazing, I'm able to hear lot of instruments, everything is crisp.

    Problem:

    With the Classic, being a puny speaker compared to the Chane's, the volume knob was set to -45 - with that I was able to get a decent amount of volume and clarity.
    With the Chane's, to get the same amount of volume I'm setting it to -20 and above to get a decent amount to be produced from the speakers.


    Question:

    Did i set it up incorrectly, or YPAO is messing it up? Or that is all the RX-V471 is capable of?

    Please point me in the right direction...

    -SDB

  • #2
    Please defeat any speaker or room EQ from the AVR. We want to start with a neutral baseline and then only add EQ once the system is in place and we're sure all is well.

    If you were using the entire Energy system - meaning with the subwoofer - then it may be that as a combination it's more efficient. The A1.4 is also a true 8 ohm load and will need more volume control to reach similar levels than either a lower impedance speaker or a larger speaker system or both.

    A higher setting doesn't mean the amplifier is delivering more power, just that you'll need more volume control rotation to get the same output into the higher impedance speaker. The A1.4 will reach the amplifier's maximum output higher up the volume setting scale.

    The A1.4 is also a smoother, more relaxed sound - lower distortion overall. This can fool the ear into thinking it's quieter than it really is. This could show up if one were to measure real sound pressure levels in the room and compare the two systems.

    Comment


    • #3
      Something similar that happened to me was when I tried a Marantz AVR. I believe it was the 6010 model. I ran Aydyssey XT32, which pretty much always sets my from 3 speaker to full range. I always go back and change everything to small at 80hz.

      Then I went ahead to listen to music and watch a couple of movies, and I noticed that I had to set the volume for the Marantz SR6010 to 0 dB's to get the same sound I was getting from my Denon AVR X4200.

      This was was still present even after testing it with my Emotiva LPA-1 amp. The one thing I remember now that I didn't do was to disable any of the audio EQ from the Marantz. I know that I disabled those from my X4200. So, now I am wondering if that would of had any effect?

      I ended up keeping the Denon X4200 since the app worked better.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks Jon, GFOViedo:

        I had some spare time last weekend, so disabled eq and played with both my old energy and new A1's - with same result. Energy reached the level at -40 volume level and A1's at -15. But the difference was it wasn't pleasant listening to energy above that, but with A1.4 i went up to +5db volume level but my room didn't like it above that, neither did my wife, had to stop there!

        And I understand all this could be more meaningful if I had used some SPLM! - Novice here!

        Jon, I understood what you meant. Since A1.4 being a true 8 ohm, it is going to reach the required noise level required by me at the higher volume closer to 0 db with my current receiver - with my googling skills, I read that is where the receiver distorts.

        My question is will I get noticeable difference in audio quality with a better(powerful) receiver than what I'm hearing with my current receiver with volume level set at 0db assuming the other powerful receiver can deliver the volume I'm looking for at a lower leve​l.

        ~I don't know whether the question makes any sense!


        GFOViedo thanks for sharing your experience. My change was is in ohms and yours in watts! Based on the responses here, I may lean towards getting the denon x4300 too.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by satishdelhibabu View Post
          ...will I get noticeable difference in audio quality with a better(powerful) receiver than what I'm hearing with my current receiver with volume level set at 0db assuming the other powerful receiver can deliver the volume I'm looking for at a lower leve​l.
          A good speaker opens a window on the rest of the system. The idea that all amps sound alike has been refuted countless times, although each time I'm sure it was while a perceptive user was encountering a genuinely good speaker.

          Our models have far more usable headroom than anything I'm aware of in their class, size for size, dollar for dollar. They will respond to higher quality amplifiers and they will give you a cleaner, louder, more dimensional and more dynamic overall sound. They "like" to be run higher up in the average dynamic envelope, so to put it.

          The trick can be to seek out higher current amplifiers and receivers. This doesn't mean more rated power, but rather an amplifier that can double or nearly double its short term output into 4 ohms versus its long term 8 ohm rating.

          Look for these dynamic ratings and if they're present, you could have found a more capable amplifier. This is one way a good set of separates with an external power amplifier can sound noticeably better than an inexpensive AVR. You don't have to resort to separates, but they can reveal this audible phenomenon at work. Find an AVR with those characteristics even in a smaller power range and it'll give you much of the same effect.

          Comment


          • #6
            I would recommend a good 2 channel amp for critical music listening. I think you will be very happy with that in the system.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Jon Lane View Post
              Look for these dynamic ratings and if they're present, you could have found a more capable amplifier. This is one way a good set of separates with an external power amplifier can sound noticeably better than an inexpensive AVR. You don't have to resort to separates, but they can reveal this audible phenomenon at work. Find an AVR with those characteristics even in a smaller power range and it'll give you much of the same effect.
              My quest begins... Probably have to time it right so that I have my receiver and amp setup before the new speaker lineup is released!Thanks Jon.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Quenten View Post
                I would recommend a good 2 channel amp for critical music listening. I think you will be very happy with that in the system.
                Thanks Quenten, first thing - have to find a decent receiver with pre-out - did not have any clue about audio when i bought my yam rec 5 years back! and the stereo amp next!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Quenten View Post
                  I would recommend a good 2 channel amp for critical music listening. I think you will be very happy with that in the system.
                  :whs: and what Jon said on the 8ohm vs 4ohm speaker VS power consumption/usage.

                  OP, your system is spec'd at Rated Output Power (1kHz, 2ch driven)
                  That is 1khz, not full range. I wish I knew a way to explain it but I went from a Denon system to a Sherbourn full range at 100watts with a power supply the size of a cantaloupe, weighing about 70lbs.

                  In doing so my sound quality improved noticeably. Hit the forums for some good ideas on amps. If budget allows, Outlaw has some amps with what appear to be decent numbers on paper. Reviews I find are positive.

                  Good luck.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I have the original A5ís, along with an A2c as the center and A1bís for the rears, with a PSA 15Vse as the subwoofer. About two years ago I upgraded to a Denon AVR-X4200W from an Onkyo TX-NR708. I love the sound of the Denon, but at the same time I feel that now I could use some more push. Anyone have any input or thoughts on an external amp? Would it help, if so, any recommendations?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ppfp76 View Post
                      Would it help, if so, any recommendations?
                      Sorry, was concentrating more on the restocking of A2.4, A5.4 and A7 stuff threads until now!

                      It helped more than I guessed for me!

                      There were two purchases I made, which in my opinion made the whole system worth it and I'm enjoying it every single day! (After upgrading my receiver, which definitely made me realize what i was missing)
                      • Bought a 125 watts RMS 2 Channel amp for a A1.4's - went with a used parasounds route to see if its really worth it!
                      • Bought a Rythmik LVX12 subwoofer - it blended really well and made the A1.4's sound much much better


                      So to answer your question, I don't have A5 or A2c - If what it did to my A1.4 applies to those too, then - it is going to do more than that!

                      To add to that, i'm going to mention the placement/setting up everything is key too! It took me couple weeks to get it right where i wanted!

                      Now, I'm in a state where,
                      • what am i going to do when the A2.4 arrives for my center
                      • when A5.4 is available should I upgrade my LR and move the A1.4 to the surrounds. My current setup is plenty loud, I do not know what I'm missing though!
                        :scratchchin:

                      I hope this helps @ppfp76!

                      Comment

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